Interview with Su Jiang (on June 12, 2014, in a hotel in Berkley, California)

Here you find the Chinese text of the interview.

Interviewer (Helmut Opletal): Please tell me, how did you come into contact with this group, and how did you analyze the situation at that time? Looking back now, how do you feel?

Su Jiang: Wang Xizhe and I were classmates. I was in junior high school and he was in high school. We didn’t know each other before the Cultural Revolution. When it began, we joined the same organization, the “Fighting Team”. Towards the end of the Cultural Revolution, we fell in love, and later we were sent to the countryside separately, but we often corresponded.

Interviewer: So you were separated when you were in the countryside?

Su: Yes, that’s true. He was sent to Yingde [northern Guangdong], and I to Huiyang [in the South]. He went back to Guangzhou first, I wasn’t back yet. After his return to Guangzhou, he met Li Zhengtian, Chen Yiyang, and Guo Hongzhi. They were engaged in political discussions, but I was still in the countryside that time. In my own thinking, I had always been close to them. When they discussed political issues, I also felt concerned. When I got involved in that group, I also drafted and put up big-character posters. A group of classmates from No. 17 Middle School were their backbone, and they all discussed political issues together. When they took them to the society, we followed them to participate. I mostly agreed with their views. When I put up big-character posters in the streets, I saw that people showed positive reactions and supported us. That confirmed to me that they were right, so I supported their activities and worked with them. But then, when they were suppressed, I was also harassed. I was working at the Guangzhou Water Company then, and our unit held “study classes” [actually compulsory indoctrination sessions] at that time. He was in jail, and our child was only a few months old then. They said that without a child, they wouldn't let me go home. Later there were study groups all day, and we didn’t have to go to work. Someone was supervising us, we had to write reports, who we came in contact with, what was in our minds, like an ideological review. This lasted for several months.

Interviewer: Which year was it?

Su: It should be... I returned to Guangzhou in 1975. They wrote their big-character poster in 1974, but I had not returned at that time. I was an “educated youth sent to the mountains and the countryside” [according to Mao’s instructions], but sometimes I could go back to the city and participate in their activities. After returning to the Guangzhou in 1975, we married and had our child. I was writing dazibao, but I was arrested after the Gang of Four had fallen, and I also came under a certain pressure in my work unit. For example, in our work place they held a meeting to criticize the Li Yizhe Group. I was also criticized. Their discourses were not directed at me personally, but at their views, attacking them as counter-revolutionaries. Then I was to be examined as well. When we were rehabilitated later, a rehabilitation meeting should be as big as the original criticism meeting. I always thought the Li Yizhe Group was right. If they were criticized to be a counter-revolutionary gang, then I was also a member of such gang. I had been assigned to “study classes”, so I knew many things. Some participants of these classes were not allowed to go home in the evenings. They were kept in the workplaces where they had to write [self-criticism] reports. They were not arrested, but not allowed to move around freely either. They remained under surveillance at their workplace during the day, and had to sit and write self-criticisms and other things. In my workplace I was the only one that had participated in the Li Yizhe group.

Interviewer: So what did you write?

Su: They sent someone to monitor me. I didn’t write much, I just wrote that I thought Li Yizhe’s ideas were right, and explained it, that was all. There was a woman, a colleague of mine, who was assigned to watch me. There was nothing to do, everything had been written up already, and we didn’t need to write anything more. So she was knitting, and I was knitting too. When someone came, she just said put it away, that was it. But I was thinking all the time that their views were correct, actually most people thought so.

Interviewer: In 1981, when Wang Xizhe was arrested the second time, what did this mean for you and your family?

Su: It had bigger consequences for our family. My sister actually was a young girl that didn’t care about politics. But because of the Li Yizhe affair, she was also put in a “class”. So my family was affected, especially my sister. Although she was a young apolitical girl, her work unit asked her to criticize her brother-in-law's reactionary words and deeds at home. As a result, due to the pressure on her, she became mentally ill with schizophrenia. She has never recovered after that. When she was released, things got better for a while, but when he was arrested for the second time, she committed suicide. This was a big blow for our family. Until now, our family is suffering the consequences from this affair, and our home has been searched.

Interviewer: Your child is a boy. How old is he? What did he know about the situation when his father was in prison?

Su: When he was in prison, we could visit him once every six months. Ever since he was two or three years old, our son accompanied me to the prison. Every time he went...

Interviewer: What prison was he in?

A third person (Wang Xizhe): Huaiji, Prison No. 1 in Guangdong Province.

Su: The first time I went with my mother. My mother took the two of us, and packed things when we went to see him. When we got there, my mother was not allowed in, only me and the child. It was only half an hour each time. From a young child to junior high school, it was only twice a year that he saw his father.

Interviewer: Twice a year?

Su: The rule was once a month, but it was very far and took three or four days to go back and forth. It takes one day by bus from Guangzhou to Huaiji. When I got there, I spent the night first, visited the next day, stayed once more overnight, and went home on the third day.

Interviewer: Could you bring anything?

Su: I could bring some food, and send him food and books every month. The prison did not allow longer visits, only half an hour, no more than forty minutes. Like this.

Interviewer: Later, for example, in 1990 when your son was already a teenager, how did you tell him and explain to him that his father was in prison?

Su: Because he had been to the prison since he was a child, he knew about it, that his father did not commit murder or arson, nor was it a criminal matter. Me and his father and my child's grandfather, we wrote letters of complaint to the court and to the People’s Congress every year. His father was very insistent and wanted to write appeals. Even after he was sentenced, we kept writing. So maybe our son also understood this situation. Anyway, we felt that my husband’s treatment was very unjust, he had not opposed the Communist Party, just expressed some opinions, and there had been no reason to inflict such a heavy sentence on him. It was fourteen years, I wrote during fourteen years. So...his father has always been writing together with me. This was the situation. The same goes for my son. He never directly supported or opposed him, but he was aware of the process. We thought that we also wanted to protect him in school. The teacher knew a little bit, and he would never deliberately make a fuss about this matter, so it was relatively calm. We did not ask our son to explain something in school, he should just say that his father was not at home. Till now, our son's character and behavior have been a bit timid. I think it’s because of his grandpa, his grandma, my parents and all of us indulged him, and were very protective. Therefore, due to his timid character, we don’t think we have high expectations for him now.

Interviewer: Is your son also in the US now?

Su: Yes.

Interviewer: Did he come out with you?

Su: I came out first, and then he came too.

Interviewer: You came out first and he came out later?

Su: No, his father left China in 1996, I came in 1999, and my son followed in 2003.

Interviewer: How does he feel now about the past political activities of his father and you?

Su: He has no political views. One can say that he understands what we did at that time, but he doesn’t seem to support it very much. That's it. He was born in the 1970s. I remember that Sasha Gong once told me something that hit me, so I complained. I said that Chuan Chuan's character – my son's name is Chuan Chuan – that his personality was like that of a girl, not very strong. Sasha Gong said, ok, just one in your family, this will be fine. Do you want two more? When she said this, I thought, forget it, he can just be an ordinary citizen and live a good life.

Interviewer: I have seen a cross on your wall. Are you Christians now?

Su: After arriving to the United States, we participated in a church, someone had taken me there.

Wang Xizhe (interjects): Not really.

Su: I think in China currently there is no faith. I've always felt that this was a problem. They just take profits too seriously. It’s impossible without faith. Chinese people are becoming less and less religious now. But I don't know, why now? I have seen a lot of news saying that in Wenzhou they are demolishing their churches now and not allowing them to worship God. I am just casually saying so. I think that if China wants to change its status, it may have to start with morality, faith, and children’s education. Only by changing this, can we build a good foundation. Otherwise, we will keep fighting back and forth, a faction left and a faction right, but these are not the fundamental issues. That’s how I feel.